my 2 cents about the whole teacher thing
Thanks everyone. I was hoping this wouldn't be taken the wrong way...and it wasn't. But to clarify my main point...I am not choosing to not have a teacher right now...I can't have a teacher. I think there are many people here who can't as well. I was simply stating that it is wonderful to hear good responses to questions rather than the suggestion of getting a teacher. I would love to have a teacher, but after all these years, I think I've finally just accepted that I won't have one. I also understand the extreme value of a teacher..I wasn't trying to deny that.
I loved the replies! Jeff, your 60 year old player you ran into...I think thats what its all about!
I loved the replies! Jeff, your 60 year old player you ran into...I think thats what its all about!
>> But all the players follow different styles - how can you know if the Ho-Ro is played in Myoan style or in Kinko? There is no literature about it.
To Christian; there is literature about how to play the Myoan style of Taizan-ha; here it is:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/25980568/Tominomori_Kyozan_Myoan_Instruction.pdf
To Christian; there is literature about how to play the Myoan style of Taizan-ha; here it is:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/25980568/Tominomori_Kyozan_Myoan_Instruction.pdf
"Jeff Cairns""Jeff Cairns"The whole teacher/no teacher thing is spoken to new learners simply to give them an advantage in learning with fewer frustrations and perhaps less time spent on basic things, but if someone isn't interested in that route, or can't take it as was the case with the man in my story, then let their discovery be fueled by desire and the rewards will follow.
As a side note, since he knew how to use a computer, I suggested that he try to get lessons on skype. He seemed quite amused by that, but said he will check into it.
If one can afford a teacher, and of course now that we are blessed with digital technology, the teacher does not even have to be face to face, then I wholeheartedly agree with Jeff's point about the learning process being more efficient and less frustrating with a teacher.
Sometimes, on the forum, I can really sense the frustration of those trying to learn not only the nuances of fingering and embouchure with the flute but also the variations in notation and expression of different playing traditions. There is so much to explain and some of it is close to impossible without actually seeing what the player is doing while they play. And then, naturally, a reference is made to having a teacher and then again, maybe, another suggestion about having a teacher. And then of course it can seem like there's more desire for forum members to push getting a teacher than desire to help the player. But learning shakuhachi is a complex, yes, a very satisfyingly complex, process and with a teacher the experience can be less confusing and more straight forward than if ones learns to play and read the music in isolation. That said, there's no crime in learning on one's own. There's no fault in creating sound of your own liking. There's absolute beauty in blowing through raw and rough bamboo with joy in your heart and emptiness in your mind. I respect that deeply.
To have a teacher or not to have a teacher, depends on you, your circumstances and your state of mind.
Last edited by Erin on 2011-05-14, 06:40; edited 1 time in total
We named this section "The Playpen" so that beginners would feel comfortable posting newbie questions, posting their sound files or videos, and in general being comfortable as novices without being judged too harshly by people who think they know better. We've kept a tolerant tone in this topic. Perry and some others have told me that beginners feel threatened when everyone tells them what to do.
David, are there any teachers within your region?
David, are there any teachers within your region?
May I be so bold to ask everybody to read Davids posts again?
Summary: 1. rollercoaster budget + family to maintain = not much money left for your own leisure (if you're a responsible person)
2. possessing no computer => no skype => no skype lessons
Why are you continuing to suggest skype-lessons or to ask if there is no teacher nearby?
I always can be wrong, but in my opinion David just wrote his 2 cents to express his gratitude to everybody who was kind enough to help/advise in this and the other forum. Maybe a polite answer would have been: Your welcome David, please don't hesitate to ask if you have any questions.
"david""david"I work 2 jobs and have a wife and 2 children. I have little time for much anything, but I do put in my own practice time whenever I can. I don't have a computer at home, so I can't skype...and I don't want to. When I am at home and not working I want to spend that time with my family and not on a computer. Plus my budget is a rollercoaster.
Summary: 1. rollercoaster budget + family to maintain = not much money left for your own leisure (if you're a responsible person)
2. possessing no computer => no skype => no skype lessons
Why are you continuing to suggest skype-lessons or to ask if there is no teacher nearby?
I always can be wrong, but in my opinion David just wrote his 2 cents to express his gratitude to everybody who was kind enough to help/advise in this and the other forum. Maybe a polite answer would have been: Your welcome David, please don't hesitate to ask if you have any questions.
Well..........some teachers don't charge for lessons or barter. One of my students pays me with abalone.
Thank you Dun Romin!
I think there are many self taught players out there who don't post because they know the response they will get. Even now I am being told to get a teacher. No...all I am asking is that we make this new forum what it is supposed to be...a tool for learning and sharing knowledge on how to play and enjoy the shakuhachi.
I think there are many self taught players out there who don't post because they know the response they will get. Even now I am being told to get a teacher. No...all I am asking is that we make this new forum what it is supposed to be...a tool for learning and sharing knowledge on how to play and enjoy the shakuhachi.
Slow down David I don't think anybody has "told" you to get a teacher. 
Nobody is telling anybody what to do around here.
Nobody is telling anybody what to do around here.
Brian, when we meet one day (Kyoto2012?) we should decide to have a drink and a discussion about cultural differences between the western continents/nations.
Well Dun, I have lived in North America, Europe and Australia and there are only a few differences.
1. Europe is old
2. America is new
3. Australia is really new
I've moved around a lot but now I'm "done roamin'"!
1. Europe is old
2. America is new
3. Australia is really new
I've moved around a lot but now I'm "done roamin'"!
Quick mind! 
"Brian Tairaku Ritchie""Brian Tairaku Ritchie"Nobody is telling anybody what to do around here.
"Brian Tairaku Ritchie""Brian Tairaku Ritchie"Slow down David
It's starting to feel like the old forum again. How I missed it! 
So where's edosan??
Okay, well, here's my take on not having a teacher. It's kind of like being self-educated in that the self-educated person will often have gaps in his knowledge and probably will never realize it, because he doesn't know what all there is to be known about a subject. But what he likely does have is a wider range of learning experiences that give him a knowledge and understanding that are unique to him.
I'm reminded of the story about the grandfather walking with his grandson through a field covered with snow. As the old man walks steadily onward, the boy darts this way and that, looking behind that tree, turning over that rock, and so on. When they reach the far edge of the field, the grandfather stops and says to the boy,
"Look how your tracks wander aimlessly this way and that with no apparent purpose and how my tracks make a direct line straight across the field. You must walk through life in a direct and straightforward way such as I have done if you wish to be successful."
The boys thinks about all the fascinating things he saw all over the field, and he says,
"But Grandfather, you missed everything!"
So where's edosan??
Okay, well, here's my take on not having a teacher. It's kind of like being self-educated in that the self-educated person will often have gaps in his knowledge and probably will never realize it, because he doesn't know what all there is to be known about a subject. But what he likely does have is a wider range of learning experiences that give him a knowledge and understanding that are unique to him.
I'm reminded of the story about the grandfather walking with his grandson through a field covered with snow. As the old man walks steadily onward, the boy darts this way and that, looking behind that tree, turning over that rock, and so on. When they reach the far edge of the field, the grandfather stops and says to the boy,
"Look how your tracks wander aimlessly this way and that with no apparent purpose and how my tracks make a direct line straight across the field. You must walk through life in a direct and straightforward way such as I have done if you wish to be successful."
The boys thinks about all the fascinating things he saw all over the field, and he says,
"But Grandfather, you missed everything!"
"RickM""RickM"Okay, well, here's my take on not having a teacher. It's kind of like being self-educated in that the self-educated person will often have gaps in his knowledge and probably will never realize it, because he doesn't know what all [sic] there is to be known about a subject.
So the self-educated person doesn't know everything about some thing and probably doesn't realize what he doesn't know because he doesn't know everything about some thing there is to know? It would seem to follow that knowing everything about some thing is a necessary condition for realizing you don't know everything about it. I wonder.
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